Engine knock or pings would be due to the fuel side of things, not the oil.

I'm glad you mentioned shear strength. A good synthetic will do well at shear protection. There is permanent shear and temporary shear. It is a very important aspect to keep in mind.

In over 10 years of me selling oil I have found most excessive oil consumption is due to the PCV. A very high percentage of people I talk to do not even know what that is or that they need to replace it.

There are a few types of vehicles that are prone to oil consumption, that's the fault of the manufacturer.

Beyond that most petroleums and full synthetics will lose 20% in volatility and cause sludge.

In extremely rare cases I've seen motors consume oil because the rings and cylinder walls are shot.

 

Here's a true story about a friend of mine from way back in 1974...
He drove a Vega 140,000 miles and NEVER changed the oil - he used some very cheap $h!+ called 'COOK's Oil' that was re-refined crude and sold out of Ft. Worth - he only changed the filter about every 2500 miles and added a quart :hide:. Maybe it was the crud that held the POS Vega together for so many miles .

 

I had a buddy who drove a Vega - auto-crossed it regularly. He was still in school when he bought it and was too poor to opt for a tach, so he put a Thrush muffler on it to judge engine speed.

He was still driving it at 189K when it got away from him on a wet interstate ramp. One of those concrete pads for the street lights took out the bottom of the car. Considering what junk those things were, that was remarkable.

 

Hi BigArt,
Bearing , or rod knock is a result of bearing and journal wear and is very much relevant to oiling and lubrication. Piston slop in a high mileage motor will not always be a knocking such as a rod knock, but can also sound like a loud tapping. Tappet or lifter tapping, since the engine has hydraulic lifters, it is pertinent to oil. Chrysler uses a rocker arm shafts these too are affected by oil flow and lubrication, and can also cause "lifter" like knock if they, the rocker arms, start to bind, or get sloppy or worn.

 

HemiFun.. I had an 88 Cherokee with 197K miles on it. My buddy and I pulled it because we wanted to freshen up the motor, it was still a running motor. The pan was full of sludge. The bearings were showing all kinds of copper marks from wear. It was still running, but it looked bad, I'm glad we did a rebuild on it. That was before I was into oil.


preachp.. I was referring to engine knock, aka dieseling and pinging known as predetonation. Dieseling is almost not heard of because of electronic fuel injection and electronic fuel pumps, but the inherent problem of carbon build up is still there. But ya, you're right too. If you hear that kind of noise you're in big trouble.

I'm well aware of the internals of the hemi. I've been around many a cam install and ended up rebuilding my motor on my hemi when a valve guide let go. Me and some buddies on here rebuilt the motor in the garage and my brother is still driving it to this day. When we pulled that motor with just over a 100K on it the bearings looked like new and cylinder walls still showing all the helical machine marks. The #5 cylinder was bad though, it had to be bored I think only 15-20 over if memory serves.

I also recently help tear down and put together a new motor for my buddy Ken. He's got some money in his setup!

 

Hi BigArt,

Just clarifying what I was talking about.
Have a great day!
preachp

 

That is fine and I thank you for it.

I hope people don't take me the wrong way either. Ya I'm an AMSOIL Dealer, but I'm not trying to push it on anyone. If they want it, they got it at wholesale from me. If they don't want it, that's fine too.

I'm having a great day. It's Friday! Tomorrow I'm taking my daughter to the rifle range for her birthday. She just got her first rifle. A .22 bolt action. I'm a very proud Daddy!

 

Hi Big Art,

Well HAPPY Birthday to your Little one! I remember my first rifle. It was a Savage .222 Remington magnum bolt action. That thing could split hairs at 100 yards. Great varmit/ deer gun. Have fun, shoot a round or two for me.

preachp

 

AMSOIL in my 2007 Harley, Mobil 1 in my 2007 Ram, and my wife's 2005 Chevy Malibu Maxx.

 

Switched from Mobil 1 5W20 Synthetic, in my 07' Ram, to AMSOIL XL 5W20 Synthetic oil, no longer deal with anything other than my 07' Harley which still runs on AMSOIL 10W50 Synthetic oil.

 

OEM recommended oil for now. Then I haven't decided yet. :facepalm:

 

I always find this kind of funny.

I'll have customers that will use it in their bike, but not their other vehicles.

I'll have customers that will use it in their truck, but not their bike or wifes car.

I'll have customers that swear by it in one of their pieces of equipment, but not use it in all their equipment.

I'll even have customers love the motor oil, but haven't switched to it in the diff or trans.

It's rare that a customer will use it all their vehicles and replace all fluids. I have a few, but a small few.

I guess it's just a frame of mind.

I just find it amusing.

 

Well, time for that first Oil change with the new engine. I found this at Auto Zone and picked it up. About $3.50 per quart less then Mobil 1, and $4.50 less then RP.

It says Full Synthetic but in the spec's it says Oil Composition: Mineral.
Whats up with that? Does anyone think this is any good?

Mike, I know! lol :facepalm:

 

That will do fine

 

Full synthetic is petroleum!

 

Then what is Amsoil and the other synthetic brands? Partial synthetic?

 

Hi kcd1369,

I would be VERY leary of anything that says "mineral" for its composition. If that is a mineral oil base and you use it IIRC you could damage your engine, and have some warranty issues. Check out what they mean by "composition mineral".

preachp

 

AMSOIL OE and XL are "full synthetic"

The other AMSOIL products are 100% synthetic.
i.e. Signature Series, Gear Lubes and ATF.

 

Now I'm really confused. When I know a lot has changed in the schools these days. But A long time ago when I was in math, Full and 100% meant the same. :banghead: Whats the deal? :facepalm: This is making my head hurt.

 

Full and 100% still mean the same, what you run into is three basic levels of oil. You can buy the mineral type oil that's been around forever, then you have blended oils which are a combination of mineral and synthetic, and last you have the modern synthetic oil which is far superior in the protection of Gas & Diesel engines. I run synthetic oils and lubes in all my vehicles.

 

No it doesn't. FULL and 100% do not mean the same thing.

FULL SYNTHETIC is a marketing term used by Castrol years ago. Mobil took them to court over calling Castrol Syntec a synthetic. It's a group 3 petroleum, but the Florida court ruled that because the product was changed X amount that it could be called synthetic. So every tom dick and harry started calling their products Full synthetic even though they come from a group 3 petroleum product.

AMSOIL has changed labels to 100% synthetic on their top tier products to differentiate themselves. 100% synthetic from AMSOIL is a Group 4 oil derived from natural gas. It is void of paraffins and petroleums.


Hope this helps you guys.

 

:iagree:

 

Yep, thanks.

 

I myself will pour in @ my first OCI @ 3K miles-->New 14' 5.7L Hemi

5Qts--M1 0W-20
2Qts--M1 0W-40 w/either Amsoil or Wix Filter.

Will install a Fumoto drain valve @ first OCI & Send in a UOA @ 3K miles to Polaris Labs to see how this oil combo is doing in the new engine.

We use this same combo in my sons 09 5.4L Triton 3V after UOA we have seen this combo go easily past 10K mile OCI.

We normally Change it once a year just before Winter-{Dec 1st}
The 5.4L 3V now has 213K miles on her and barely uses a drop between oil changes.
No Smoke @ startup nor while running or @ full throttle.

Every UOA has come back Stellar!!! Polaris Labs tells us Job Well Done with a big Hi Five!

I'm not telling anyone else to use this combo. This is just My Son's and I experience. Next Goal is 500K miles on the 5.4L 3V... He has 4 more years of Engineering School left so We will see if we achieve those miles.

 

SyN, that oil combo has obviously worked in the Ford, but how did you come across that different oil combo and choose to go ahead and try it? IE what benefits does it have compared to Amsoil, RP, Mobil 1, Kendall, etc.

 

I have to ask.. what made you come up with that combo to try?

Glad you're doing UOA, that's the best thing to do.

 

I have to ask.. what made you come up with that combo to try?

Glad you're doing UOA, that's the best thing to do.

------------------------------------------------

:iagree: Please keep us posted on the combo results :thumb:.
I would be interested to know what the actual viscosity might be at normal operating temperatures with this combo.

 

Since 05 I have been loyal member @ Used Oil Analysis - Bob is the Oil Guy - Bob is the Oil Guy

Since that time-->Many of the well-respected tribologists have left. But there are a hand full of well respected ones left.

I have followed a handful who have been toying with This Combo & Similar Combos. I have been paying very close attention to UOAs as well as VOAs.

Those who follow Bobistheoilguy-->Know M1 0W-40 is one of M1 most Robust Oils.
M1 0W-20 is also falling into that same category.

Will this same combo work as well inside the New Hemi as the 09 5.4L 3V? I have know idea. I'm sure there are many different metal types within this new 5.7L compared to the 5.4L. Hence the reason for the UOA.

I will experiment a few times to hopefully find the same results.

I also believe I could have achieved similar results with a regular Dino Oil. Thousands of owners are doing it as I type this.

There are many members of bobistheoilguy who are using this combo or very similar, each posting their results. Thus over the years finding the right combo for each particular engine. There is not one engine out there alike nor driven the same.

Keeping that engine in Tip Top Shape is crucial. I am more anal about the clean air coming into the engine then the type of oil I pour into that engine. {Just Me}!

I am still thinking about in the summer pour in 5Qts M1 5W-20 & Winter switch to 0W-20. I really don't think the 5.7L will be able to tell the difference.

Anyway-->This is just a small part of my reasoning. Visit Bobistheoilguy and look at all the UOA posted and VOA posted.... Talk about a Migrane!!!

 

I don't want anyone else within this forum doing what my son and I have been doing with this combo--->Just by word of mouth from myself...

Spend a few hours or many hours @ Used Oil Analysis - Bob is the Oil Guy - Bob is the Oil Guy

I enjoy doing this type of experiment and seeing the results through UOA. We have never hurt this engine buy switching Viscosity. The UOA have proven that.

My advice is -->You do the research and reading then make your decision.... NEVER go by just Word of Mouth!!! ESP on the Wicked Internet!!!

 

I've been using Royal Purple. Sure looks pretty going in!

 

You do realize you could go 1 year or 25,000 miles and it's guaranteed with AMSOIL?

Save the money vs UOA and M1. Just sayin.

I think it's kewl that you're experimenting and all, but the 0-40 isn't recommended in your 14' Hemi.

 

I just have a slight problem with any product that goes in my engine that has "soil" in the name. What assurances can you give that this oil you speak of is safe, and has been properly strained, removing all dirt or any other contaminants? I'm going to get off of here now and listen to your response. Thank you.

 

Art: Thank you for your thoughts and advice.

I myself don't have to have Amsoil in my 5.7L to do 1 year OCI.

I can do that easy with the M1 0W-20 & 0W-40 combo. I am Very Confident I can achieve 500K miles or greater with these 2 oils. " Doing once a year oil changes."

Granted the first few oil changes will be followed by a UOA.

I know Amsoil has Great Products. I have been a PC for 18 years.
After all the breakin periods are reached on the new Ram, Amsoil products will be used in

1. Rearend+Frontend
2. Transfer Case
3. Powersteering
4. Transmission

Truth is! I could very easily reach 500K miles on this 5.7L with really any top brand oil... I know what I am doing and how to properly take care of an auto.

I just prefer these 2 M1 products. They have proven over and over to be Great Performers together.

I'm not one to be a follower of the Flock! Never Have Never Will! I always seem to be the One Following my Gut instead.

As for 0W-40 not being recommend? My Sons 5.4L 3V is Proof that 5W-20 is for Café Only! Once mixed with the 0W-20 the Hemi will not know the difference and will love the Robust Additive Package.