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Old 02-04-2018, 10:39 AM   #1
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Stroke Combo

Inevitably when discussing a new engine build , one of the 1st questions has always been “what kind of Combo can we build”
Soooo here’s a list of some of the 5.7 combo that can be built with currently available parts (2/2/2018)
And this is only 5.7s , remember that the Eagle blocks(09 &up) are limited to a .030 over bore, where the 03-08s can safely use the .040 over bore pistons(max bore is larger but that’s a different thread)
Off the shelf pistons choices at this moment are Diamond, DSS Racing, Icon, Manley Mahle and Wiesco
I left out CP Carrillo’s because as of this writing their offerings are a Pin Hgt of 1.10 and use a .886 wrist pin…they are basically a max effort race piece.
Diamond, they offer two different pin heights (Pin Hgt), 1.220 uses a stock wrist pin Día of .945 and the 2nd is 1.090 with a .927 wrist pin. Bore selection is .020 and .030 over only
D.S.S. Racing, has 2 flat top pistons with a Pin Hgt of 1.210 one with a .945 pin the other uses the .927 pin. The other 1.21 they offer is a +14CC dome, They offer two 1.090 both with .927 pins one flat top the other +9 CC dome. All of DSS’s pistons are available Std Bore +.030, +040
ICON offers three Pin Hgt, 1.22,1.165,1.090, all three uses .927 pin and over bores are .0015,010,020,030,040.
Manley only offers two Pin Hgt, 1.220 and 1.085 both use .927 pins., bores sizes are STD, 3.922 and 3.937
Mahle, has a 1.095 Pin Hgt, with a .927 pin in .020 +.030 +.040 over size.
Wiesco, all their pistons are available in bore sizes Std +.020. +030, their “drop in” 5.7 pistons are 1.220 with a 9.45 pin, the next is a 1.205 Pin Hgt .927 pin They have a 1.090 Pin Hgt also uses a .927.
Last ones that Wiesco offers is for the 4.080 stroke cranks, Pin Hgt is 1.080, but uses .866 Pin Hgt, basically a max effort race piece.
Now this list isn’t a be all end all, there are some other combo’s
Some notes on the cranks, I left out the more extreme offsets, limited the offset grinds to a max of .05 which is most common when going from a 2.10 rod journal to a 2.0. now some people will go as far as .08 offset for this modification. I’m not one of them, also left out the Honda journal (1.889) off sets great for max effort. But personally, I wouldn’t put a lot of miles on that …. it’s worked for a lot of people.
The 6.4 Apache crank (and the Eagle 5.7) need to have the front snout of the crankshaft modified to work in the Pre-Eagle blocks , it’s simple modification, you need to remove .62 inch from were the lower timing sprocket rides, essentially moving the sprocket back wards towards the oil pump.
the more common rod journal is listed as (2.0 RJ) or 2.1 RJ)
(^) cranks are available from KI, Manley, Scat and Molnar.
All calculations were done using 9.25 as a deck height. I’ve found that real world deck Hgt for pre-Eagle is about 9.239 after decking, Eagles I haven’t done enough or seen enough to say definitively but the 3 I have done have been 9.25 after decking.
DC claimed the Blue print height on the pre-Eagle is 9.25 I’ve heard/read conflicting numbers on the Eagle.
Notes,
* this Comp HT of 1.15 would have to use a modified piston from ICON to work strictly because it falls under the available pin Ht of 1.165

STD Bore +040 Stroke Rod Length Comp Ht CI
3.917-3.957 3.58(Stock) 6.24 (2.1 RJ) 1.22 345-352
3.917-3.957 3.68(S+.05 Offset) 6.24 ( 2.0 RJ) 1.17 355-362
3.917-3.957 3.68(S+.05 Offset) 6.125 (2.0 RJ) 1.21 355-362
3.917-3.957 3.724(6.4 Stock) 6.24 (2.1 RJ) 1.15* 359-366
3.917-3.957 3.724(6.4 Stock) 6.20 (2.1 RJ) 1.188 359-366
3.917-3.957 3.75(6.4+.013 Offset) 6.20 (2.0 RJ) 1.188 362-369
3.917-3.957 3.75(6.4+.013 Offset) 6.125 (2.0 RJ) 1.25 362-369
3.917-3.957 3.824(6.4+.05 Offset) 6.125 (2.0 RJ) 1.213 367-376
3.917-3.957 3.795(Molnar) 6.24 (2.1 RJ) 1.13 366-373
3.917-3.957 3.795(Molnar) 6.20 (2.1 RJ) 1.17 366-373
3.917-3.957 3.795(Molnar) 6.125(2.10 RJ) 1.24 366-373
3.917-3.957 3.90 (Molnar) 6.20 (2.0 RJ+) 1.10 376-384
3.917-3.957 3.90 (Molnar) 6.125(2.0 RJ+) 1.175 376-384
3.917-3.957 4.00 (Molnar) 6.125 (2.1 RJ) 1.125 386-394
3.917-3.957 4.05 (^) 6.125(2.0 RJ) 1.10 390-398
3.917-3.957 4.05 (^) 6.00 (2.0 RJ) 1.22 390-398
3.917-3.957 4.08 (^) 6.125(2.0 RJ) 1.085 393-401
3.917-3.957 4.08 (^) 6.00 (2.0 RJ) 1.21 393-401
3.917-3.957 4.25 (^) 6.00 (2.0 RJ) 1.125 410-418



I previewed it a few time and I apologize for how bunched up the combo's look....interweb thing isn't my forte most days.
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Old 02-04-2018, 12:59 PM   #2
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That post would be a good start to a sticky.
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Old 02-04-2018, 01:46 PM   #3
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Brother that's a ton of information. I hope it warms up enough for you to get out to the shop soon. Agreed, this is sticky material... you know what I mean..
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Old 02-04-2018, 02:28 PM   #4
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Old 02-04-2018, 05:02 PM   #5
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I love long winded Rick haha
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Old 02-04-2018, 05:42 PM   #6
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Oh it’s stuck gotta have somewhere to get my info for another build down the road lol!
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Old 02-04-2018, 06:17 PM   #7
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I'm sensing there are some big motors coming to the HTC community.
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Old 02-05-2018, 03:12 AM   #8
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6.1/6.2/6.4 Hemi engine combos?
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Old 02-05-2018, 03:16 AM   #9
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Old 02-05-2018, 05:41 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost03hemi View Post
6.1/6.2/6.4 Hemi engine combos?

The 6.1's I'll have by next Monday, math wise it's the same as above , but piston selection is limited to Pin Hgts of 1.22 ,1.09 and few 1.085 .
the 6.2 and 6.4 ,parts are just now starting to hit the aftermarket, I know the 6.4s are limited to a max bore of .030 (4.12) the 6.2 Hellcat block I don't know I haven't soniced one yet, bought one Friday having it shipped in this week, the 2 I bought last summer were both used as a stock bore builds.
A 6.2/6.4(BGE) block with an .03 over bore and 4.25 crank (4.12X4.25) would be 453.27..... Manley right now offers a 4.10 (STD+.010) with a 1.12 Pin Hgt.
4.10 bore would be 448.88 CI , a more realistic build is 430.9 (4.1X4.08) with a 6.125 rod and a Pin Hgt of min 1.085 would be more long-term friendly.
some of the 4.25 stroke combos are using a 6.125 rod, but the Pin Hgt of the piston is around 1.03 , which leaves very little room for the ring pack and as far as I know there are no off the shelf 1.0 to 1.03 Pin Hgt pistons so they would have to be custom.
if the builder is slightly off in their bore machinating or ring filling the hockey puck size pistons have a tendency to rock in the bore and loose seal. so keep in mind you want to limit your minimum piston Pin Hgt to 1.085 even that puts the wrist pin in the oil ring.
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