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Old 02-01-2016, 01:11 PM   #1
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Cam Options

New here. Wanted to get some alternative input from you guys on camshaft upgrades for the Gen 4 Hemi Ram. I'm specifically interested in the 6.1 or 6.4 cam or something similar. My truck is a 12 and has VVT. If I can keep it fine. If not, that's fine too. And I realize the truck will have to be tuned to handle the cam. With that said -

I've been told on another forum that you absolutely CANNOT run either of these cams in a full size ram without 4.56 gears and 3K stall. Here's where I struggle with that -

I have the 6.1 cam in our SRT charger and SRT magnum - both 6.1 cars. Both with 3.06 gears both with stock, factory low stall converters. And similar in weight, as both are heavy cars So...how again would it not be an upgrade?

If you took a take out or crate 6.1 and put it in the ram - with all the harness and necessary tuning - would it not run better than the 5.7 that's in it? The 3.55 Ram gear would actually be an improvement from what the 6.1 cars had, would it not?

Thanks in advance for any advice or info.

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Old 02-01-2016, 01:51 PM   #2
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The 6.1 motor is non VVT, so that cam is not an option for your 2012.

The 6.4 cam is an option, but it makes less tq in the lower rpms and about 20hp more in the upper rpms. In a truck with a stock converter and 3.55 gears, this means that cam is going to make your truck more sluggish off the line than it is now with the stock cam. It will pull a little harder from a roll, but end result on a 1/4 mile race is not going to show any gain. Same princile applies with the guys that thought it would be an upgrade to go with the 6.1 intake manifold on a mostly stock truck. It raises the power curve to a higher rpm band where it actually makes your truck slower unless you have the gear and converter to get you into that higher rpm band.

4.10 or higher gears and a higher stall tq converter are not at all required for the truck to run with a bigger cam, but without them you will never see the potential of a larger cam...You just wont be able to get into the cam's powerband quick enough, and your recovery rpm at the start of each gear with a stock converter is going to cause you to drop below the tq peak of the larger cam as well.

The gearing is completely different in the car transmission than it is in the truck, and that is why they are a bit more forgiving when it comes to installing a larger cam. Just as the 8sp transmission in the Ram trucks is more forgiving because of how it is geared.

These 5.7 VVT trucks have been on the road for 7 years now, many guys have installed different cams and failed, only a few have succeeded. I've seen quite a few try the 6.4 cam, many have tried the much bigger off the shelf Comp cams, Inertia and Arrington have put out a few that have run decent in the trucks with supporting mods, but I have yet to see a single cammed 4th gen with a stock converter and 3.55's get anywhere close to a 12.99 pass in the 1/4. My advice is the same now as it has always been...install your supporting mods (intake, longtubes, tuner), gears, and converter first, and then figure out what you want to do with a cam. The cam and converter go hand in hand, so keep that in mind when choosing stall speed or what size cam you want to go with.

You can have a cam custom built for tq that will not need any gear or converter upgrades, but with the cost of the 4th gen cams being so high, I just feel there are much better ways to spend your money. There are many stock cam 4th gens running 12's now N/A...there are only 4 that have run 12's with an aftermarket cam. That is something else to think about.
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2011 Ram 1500 RC/SB 5.7L
11.99 @ 110.66 MPH N/A
11.09 @ 120.13 MPH Nitrous

2014 Ram 1500 RC/SB 5.7L 8SP
422" w/ 2.9L Whipple at 15.5psi
1/8 - 6.54 @ 108.88MPH
1/4 - 10.43 @ 136.25MPH
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Old 02-01-2016, 04:02 PM   #3
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Old 02-01-2016, 09:30 PM   #4
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Old 02-02-2016, 06:02 AM   #5
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Ok Matt. You're wearing me down. I'm ready to give up. Last point again -

So if a crate 6.1 or take out from a wrecked SRT8 was dropped into the Gen 4 Ram, with all the hassle worked out, the harness, the tune, eliminate VVT all that -

It wouldn't run better than the 5.7 that's in it?

I know what you're thinking - what is this idiot talking about.

If I look at doing cam, cam kit, phase lock, pushrods, springs, long tubes, converter, gears, etc. That could easily roll up to 5K even without the tune.

What's a 6.1 take out? $5K? I saw one on Ebay the other day with the NAG for $6500. That was a deal.

Chance's are the 6.1 won't match up with the 6 speed and the computer won't shift the transmission or something like that. Certainly problematic at best.

Our SRT Charger that Sean tuned - you could get killed in that car it's so fast. It's a death machine. I just wish this goat head had a little, just a little of the same get up and go that car has.

I won't waste anymore of your time.
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Old 02-02-2016, 06:38 AM   #6
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Old 02-02-2016, 07:40 AM   #7
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Chance, I'm only trying to help you so that you dont end up wasting your time or money. The 6.1 is a non VVT motor, so it flat out will not run in your truck without major modification to the wiring harness and computer.

You can drop a 6.4 motor into your truck though, and it will be a strong running truck simply because of the larger motor, not because of the cam that is in it.

In the 3rd gen days, many guys put the 6.1 cams in their 5.7 trucks...I was the 2nd guy to do that mod as well because it was the only option at the time. Like guys have seen with the 6.4 cam in the new 5.7 VVT motor, it made about 20hp, but no tq, and some guys even lost tq. It was an OK cam for my application though because I had the tq converter.

My whole point behind all this is that I feel like you are expecting there to be a magic cam that is going to transform your truck into something that will run with your SRT, but the simple fact is that if you follow the simple bolt ons I have mentioned with gearing and a converter, you will get so much more than you would ever gain from any cam swap. You will never see the full potential of any larger cam unless you have the supporting mods to accommodate that cam.

I'm not sure if you have run your car at the track before, but I think you would be surprised to find out that many of the bolt on rams are faster than what your tuned 6.1 SRT would run. These trucks have a lot of potential to be fast, and we have already done the testing and ground work for everyone else so that you dont have to waste a bunch of your time and money trying to learn the hard way as many other have already done in the past.
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2011 Ram 1500 RC/SB 5.7L
11.99 @ 110.66 MPH N/A
11.09 @ 120.13 MPH Nitrous

2014 Ram 1500 RC/SB 5.7L 8SP
422" w/ 2.9L Whipple at 15.5psi
1/8 - 6.54 @ 108.88MPH
1/4 - 10.43 @ 136.25MPH
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